The Meat Locker

The portal into the mind of the Gabemaster. Where his demons are running wild after breaking out of their cages.

Friday, April 15, 2005

I wrote this as a comment on a post on The Angels Cloud. Is something I hadn't written about here, so I figured I'll post it here as well. It was about how we men supposedly don't spend time with eachother unless is regarding alcohol or sports and how we don't show affection towards one another. I will add a few things here that I didn't put on the original reply since you can't edit commentaries once you post them.

I've been just to the movies or dinner with my guy friends and without alcohol and it has never been an awkward situation. So much so that this is the first time I think of this. Most of my friends are not into sports, but we go out drinking toguether and hit strip joints from time to time but at the same time we don't need any of that to hang out or spend time. We could be talking about women, politics, computers, life or any other thing that doesnt involve alcohol or sports. And as far as displaying affection to eachother we have our own "Man ways" if you will, of showing eachother affection. A special hand shake, and the "half-hug" or whatever you call it that comes after shaking hands are just some of those ways. In circumstances when someone very dear to us is leaving and we won't see eachother for a long time or viceversa, when he comes back after being gone for a long time then we do give eachother a real hug. Those are things that I know im not the only guy who does them because they are perfectly normal in our culture and society.

But now, having said all that I do have a problem with the pussification of the American Male. Im not homophobic and I've known a good number of gay guys either as co-workers or at school and never had a problem at all with it. I've never hung out with a gay guy mainly for lack of common interests just as it would be with any other straight guy I don't hang out with. But this movement or whatever you want to call it of trying to make us more "sensitive" and plain old pussy whipped along with the whole Metrosexual concept... is just ridiculous.

If a guy has to dress up for work or a date that's perfectly fine but if he is worrying about his looks every five minutes and needs to wear a gay shirt on sale at Christopher street just to show girls he knows about fashion that is just disgusting. And yes a guy should be sensitive with his girl because he should take care of her but if he is crying with any Meg Ryan movie then he needs a kick in the ass. That's what I refer to with the pussification, that not only we have to show sensitivity but it seems that we must over do it and "feel good about it" just for the sake of the girl, or because you must be politically correct ,or that somehow you must prove that you are comfortable with your maculinity. F*** all that. Two friends saying "muchos besos" I don't have a problem with it cause guys joke with eachother with things that are waaay more surprising, but if they would have actually kissed then definetely it would have been another example of how the American male is being pushed into being a pussy. A man is man and thats it. Homophobia is very bad but to go to the extreme opposite for being afraid of being labeled a homophobe, or worse that if he doesn't go that way he is supposedly displaying an "insecurity" with his masculinity is not good at all either.

If women want a guy who is all sensitive, in touch with his feelings, who knows everything about fashion designers, and can help you with your make up and has no problem kissing other guys then I suggest they get a French guy. Just good luck if walking down the street any idiot tries to do something to you, he will be the first one to get sensitive, start crying and running away. That's what you'll get for going out with a pussy.

posted by Gabemaster # 00:56

Comments:

i think there's a good point being made. so many women say they want to find a sensitive man. i'm assuming they don't know what it's like to actually date one. it really sucks when you make your boyfriend cry by accident. i know this for a fact.
anyway, i'll end this by saying that i like Manly Men, and i don't think that men should try to sensitize themselves for the sake of women (or anyone else for that matter). if you're happy with back hair and don't mind adjusting yourself in public, good for you.

# posted by Anonymous : 15/4/05 02:40

Thanks Snowy! Finally some one who agrees with me on something!
Plea se Please come back!!
Hehe

# posted by Gabemaster : 15/4/05 02:42

I think you are both boneheads, and you are both ignorant. do you think that being a macho man makes you a better man?? I think not. A real man is a well rounded man. YOu are so one dimensional it's embarrassing.

Then people wonder why I don't date latinos or republicans!

# posted by annush : 15/4/05 09:12

I never said anything about being a Macho man. I'm not machista at all I think that is the other extreme, so what is wrong with just being a normal guy. Not machista but not a girlie man either. If by well rounded you mean kissing other guys on the cheek the same way I would to a girl then I disagree with you on the definition. If I were visiting Saudi Arabia it would be a different story because is part of their culture but in this section of the world is not.

Damn, there go my chances... hey at least im honest. :P

# posted by Gabemaster : 15/4/05 10:03

por finnnnnn estoy de acuerdo con Gabeee!!!!!! yo voy a decir lo que pienso mas o menos, porque no leí mucho...no me gusta leer en ingles....la cosa es que no quiero en mi vida un hombre machista que crea que la mujer va en la cocina y el en el sofá de la sala mirando Tv...pero tampoco quiero un hombre que cuando yo llore viendo una película no pueda abrazarme porque el también esta llorando...creo que la belleza y complejidad del mundo esta en que no tenemos lo que queremos y eso es lo que amo en los hombres, las cosas que los hacen ser "hombres".....te digo algo annush...yo pensaba igual que tu....nada de hombres latinos y mucho menos dominicanos...y sabes que-.....acabo de terminar con mi novio español...y extraño la sexualidad de un latino, la sabrosura, el coro, la fuerza de un latino...no fuerza machista....sino masculina....cada raza tiene sus pro y sus contra, es cierto que los europeos (por poner un ejemplo9 son muy atentos y condescendientes....pero no te imaginas los fríos y poco fogosos que son. Para que quiero un hombre si no se va a comportar como tal???? ahora que quede clara la diferencia.....apoyo que el hombre sea hombre...no animal

# posted by Lizzie González : 15/4/05 12:19

bueno lizzie yo no se con que europeos es que tu te has estado socialisando...yo vivi en europa muchos anos y hasta el sol de hoy la mayor parte de las personas de mi circulo son europeas y tu le podras decir lo que quieras menos frios y pocos fogosos. Yo pienso que el hombre europeo es sumamente afectivo. En mis 25 anos de vida yo he salido con un hombre latino (dominicano por cierto)y esa fue la primera y ultima vez.

# posted by annush : 15/4/05 13:23

ah! se me olvido un cubano con el sali por 2 semanas...ese fue otro. Amiguitos bien, pero novios jamas en la vida!

# posted by annush : 15/4/05 13:24

You go Lizzie!
No dudo que lo Europeos sean cariñosos y afectivos pero uno lo puede ser (y quiero creer que lo soy) sin la necesidad de que para tooooodo uno tenga que ser asi y lo que quieren hacer es que uno sea diske tan cariñoso y afectivo como uno puede ser con una mujer con otro hombre asta el punto de darse besitos en la mejilla. Diske para probar que no ay homofobia o ke uno esta seguro de su hombria. Por eso menciono lo de los Metrosexuales por que se an ido overboard con este concepto.

Como dije uno puede y debe ser cariñoso con su mujer y uno muestra afeccion con los amigos. Pero llevar ese sentimentalismo y afeccion a un punto drastico y querer que uno se de besitos y se manose con otro hombres "diske por ke estan seguros de su sexualidad" o por no parecer homofobico como los Metrosexuales es querer meterle a uno cualidades que en nuestra cultura tanto latina, como Americana son cualidades y comportamientos femenininos. Que sigan sobrepasandose y es simplemente tomar hombres que se comporten como mujercitas. Y decir esto no es ser machista.

Una sola vez y fue la ultima? ah bueno yo pansaba que la habia dañado con este post no habia chance por ningun lao jajaja :P

# posted by Gabemaster : 15/4/05 14:02

Yo sólo quiero a un HOMBRE.

Creo que la palabra define lo suficiente: ser racional, con un mínimo de sensibilidad pero que no lo sea más que yo!!

Besos con sabor a Feromonas Primaverales*

# posted by Eurídice : 15/4/05 14:57

Toy con Euri...annush, te hago la misma pregunta...con que tipo de latinos te has estado socializando?

# posted by Lizzie González : 15/4/05 17:21

lamentablemente, con latinos que ven como mal el darle un beso a sus amigos :P

# posted by annush : 15/4/05 22:19

Bueno señores... I've dated the metrosexual guy and I've dated the "dramaqueen" guy and it is not a pretty thing! I think there is not a more annoying thing than a man that is more sensitive than I am and that whines more than a 15 year old girl. I don't think a man has to take the role of your girlfriend in order to make you happy, he can make u happy doing other things like sex, good foreplay, nice dinner, making u feel good about yourself but you do not need another shopping buddy or the guy that cries with you in the Meg Ryan film (in this case u want the man's shoulder and a big hug, that's all... this shows he's supportive of you and your feelings, and he cannot do that if he's crying with you). So to all women out there, stop wanting men to become pussies please! Eso le quita esa masculinidad que a todas nos gusta. Esos hombres que saben tomar decisiones y tu no te sientes insegura o la que manda en la relacion todo el tiempo.
Gabe, thanks for bringing this up without necessarily appearing to be a machista for trying to bring to a perspective the real role a man should have without losing their identity for pleasing the females. Go Manly Men!!!

# posted by Anonymous : 15/4/05 22:49

Another thing... Women tell these men to DROP THE TWEEZERS!! And to please don't wear the JEANS TIGHTER THAN I DO!!! It does not prove to be manly... more like my friends from Queer Eye.

# posted by Anonymous : 15/4/05 23:25

no need to resort to name calling, annush. and i'm not latina OR a republican. i'm just someone who dated a sensitive man and decided it wasn't an experience i wanted to repeat, ever. that doesn't mean i go for ultra manly men who think a woman's place is in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant. all i said was that i don't think guys should TRY to sensitize themselves for the sake of anyone. if saying that people should be true to themselves is ignorant, then fine, i guess i'm just a big moron. but i'd rather be a big moron than an angry bitch.

# posted by Anonymous : 16/4/05 00:10

Snowy, yo go girl! Annush mi amor no offense but you insulted us first for no reason. You know I personally don't care but I have to let others defend themselves here.

Luz: Amen!! That's probably the best supportive comment I have ever gotten hehe.!

Euridice: Gracias por esos besos de feromonas pero cuidao que despues no te me despego :P

Lizzie: Esto ay que celebrarlo!! Cuando vaya palla nos tenemos ke dar un tremendo jumo dominicano que nos tengan que recojer de la acera con una pala. Jejeje

# posted by Gabemaster : 16/4/05 02:13

jajaja Gabemaster, ¡cuando quieras!

Soy europea, española.
¿En la mujer hay algún problema?
jajajaja

En el mundo latino y en el europeo hay de todo como en todos sitios. Esto podría ser un debate sin fin ;)

Besos a todos*
Y besos a tí con sabor a mmmmm ¿a qué prefieres? ¡A Sonrisa!

# posted by Eurídice : 16/4/05 09:24

Como dicen por ahí, "en la viña del Señor aparece de todo"...no importa si somos latinos, europeos, norteamericanos, orientales, etc. La forma de ser de los hombres no depende solo de su procedencia, sino de su vida en general, sus experiencias y claro, la mujer con la que esté. No esperen que un hombre sea "fogoso" si está con una mujer que tampoco lo es...digo yo, no se.

# posted by pvilas : 16/4/05 10:11

This comment goes on behalf of Annush (she can't post right now, but she wanted all of you to know this):
"...and an angry bitch I am. I am angry that Gabemaster went off on a
tangent regarding my posting without having even read the actual
article (or even fully digesting my posting it seems). I am angry that
you people are being so close minded that you won't even consider an
alternative point of view, and that you are going along with this
without having at least read what I originally said along with the
original article.

To be completely honest I don't know why I come here...everytime I
come to this blog all I do is get pissed off. Like I said before,
there is only dimension to everything here. Look at everything that's
posted here (even the comments!), all it does is promote intolerance
(aside from the ocassional poem) and what for? Sorry Gabriel, but I'm
done dealing with this non-sense. And in the future, leave your
intolerant misinformed dissertations off my blog. I will not get
anneurism because of you."

# posted by Bracuta : 16/4/05 13:41

Annush mY Love please don't be angry there is no reason for it much less an anneurism.

You say I went off on a tangent with what you wrote but I did not.

This is what you said:"Showing affection to the people we care about should be standard practice and not something for us to be ashamed of."

And here I said that we men do spend time with one another and show affection to eachother, just not the way you seem to want us to.
You thought it was "AWESOME" when your brother said that is ok for men to kiss one another. In our Latin or American culture I DONT THINK SO. In this part of the world that kind of behavior among men only shows that they are being effeminite. Is like telling a Saudi Arabian man that is okay for men there to wear a Burka. Or telling women of our culture to show affection with eachother the same way men do. What would think if you had straight girl friends that when they see eachother their greeting is a handshake and the "half-hug" that we men sometimes do. Or if you had a bf or some guy you know who tells you that women should do that. None of this has anything to do with being homophobic or machista. Is just wanting men to adopt female behavior as the norm making men effeminate and then some take it to an extreme: The Metrosexual or what somebody said the "Drama Queen." Which is not a tangent, just a supportive argument of the point I'm making because some women want guys to be that way.

"I am angry that
you people are being so close minded that you won't even consider an alternative point of view..."

That seems to be something you have to work on because I do consider your point of view but I just don't agree with it. You seem to very quickly call people closed minded and say that they don't consider your view just because they disagree with you. Who is being closed minded there?

In any case the link for your post is right there, so maybe they read your post and feel different than you. The NY times article is a problem because it requires people to register with it. I in particular don't want to for other reasons, which would create another completely different argument if I mention it now.

Based by what you wrote that the article is about I disagree with it completely. Like I said my friends and I hang out and eat dinner toguether without alcohol or sports. And there is no awkwardness or uneasiness about it. We don't do it weekly or all the time if thats what they expect men to do but we do it once a in a while when we hang out. And I'm not the only guy who does this, my friends do it with their other friends and so on. So that in itself knocks down the theory of our society being extremely homophobic or that we have a warped value sistem like you say.
And makes the article innacurate to say the least.

You say I promote intolerance here then show me where I do, because I can swear I don't. I even mentioned I don't have a problem at all with gay people and I find Machismo another extreme behavior which I disagree with. So I have no idea what you are referring to with that. Again you talk about tolerance but look at how quickly you insulted the first girl who made a reply on this post. Just because she disagreed with you.

And believe it or not despite everything....I still Love You :)
Sp please please please take a deep breath and don't get that anneurism.

# posted by Gabemaster : 17/4/05 15:51