The Meat Locker
The portal into the mind of the Gabemaster. Where his demons are running wild after breaking out of their cages.
Sunday, January 16, 2005
"Para mandar hombres al paredon, [de fusilamiento]
prueba judicial es innecesaria"
--Ernesto "Che" Guevara--
Many people have asked me why is it that I am against "El Che" Guevara when the man is a legend, a symbol for struggle, someone who gave his life for his ideals.
First of all, I have to admit for many years I was a Che fan myself and like so many people who just hear and follow the stories but never actually do the research, I was caught up in the legend of someone who walked the walk and gave his life out of pure selflessness for the struggle of the poor. Yes I admit I used to believe all that, until one day I took the time to look up Che Guevara not the legend but the man and what I found was nothing of a hero and everything of a cold blooded and calculated murderer. Pure and simple.
First, when el Che and Castro were fighting in Cuba he volunteered to be the executioner of anyone who expressed any dissent among the ranks in Castro's guerrilla group. One who might defend him can argue that doing that was part of war and I don't particularly feel is outrageous because even under the American Uniformed Code of Military Justice in times of war mutiny can be punishable by death. However, the reason I bring that up is so one can see his background of despite being a doctor a "life saver" he volunteered to be the one who would put a gun to someone's head and pull the trigger while the person was kneeling on the ground and do this over and over again. This background reflected what he would do next. After Castro had taken power he was put in charge of "La Cabaña", a prison and one of the places were executions took place. Che authorized and personally oversought the execution of at least 600 people there. Although he was once quoted as authorizing the execution fo thousands.Now, this wasn't during the war or combat. This was after Castro had taken power and the new government was established so who were the people that were executed by Che at La Cabaña?First, anyone who showed even by word of mouth any disagreement with the regime would end up at la cabaña being tied, blindfolded and executed by Che. So yes one can say that Che gave his life for his ideals but one must also add that he killed anyone who would oppose those ideas and he truly believed that was the way a government should run because he practiced it himself. Over 600 times. Also the people who would end up at la cabaña were not just anyone who disagreed with him politically but pretty much anyone he did not like. If you were on the list of social "deviants" you could end up in front of his firing squad. What kind of people were classified as social deviants? Among others gays, and Jehovah Witnesses. So if you are gay or a loved one of yours is and you are wearing a Che Guevara shirt you might want to think about not wearing that shirt again. The same applies if you are a Jehova witness or a loved one is. Or as in my case if you don't agree with killing people just because they disagree with your views, you might want to start thinking over about the idea of supporting che. Because not only was he about killing you for those reasons but he would do so even without a trial. That is where the quote I have under his picture comes up to play, he said: "To send men to the firing squad, judicial proof is unnecessary" and he would go on on saying "These procedures are an archaic bourgeois detail. This is a revolution! And a revolutionary must become a cold killing machine motivated by pure hate. We must create the pedagogy of the paredon!! (the Wall!)". So for those of you who wear the Che's shirt and are against the death penalty ( and I know there are many of you) you also might want to think about throwing that shirt in the garbage. Because not only was he up for executing people but he would send people to the firing squad denying them a FAIR TRIAL!!!. So much for the legend of a great man. He was a cold blooded murderer who thought of himself as a great guerrillero after Cuba's revolution. But when he actually went out to conduct guerrillas of his own in different places, he failed time and again and ultimately died in Bolivia without enlisting a single bolivian peasant on his side and with the ridiculous dream of turning latin america into one communist state. Thanks god he was killed and what would have been a nightmare for the rest of us, never materialized.
There is a story about something he said before he was shot to death, I like to mention what he said right before he was captured: "Do not shoot! I am Che Guevara and worth more to you alive than dead." No Che even then you were wrong, because whether I like it or not dead you are now a mythical figure a legend, while alive you were human waste, you were a murderer.
# posted by 
Gabemaster : 17/1/05 10:41
In every revolution there is, people have to die...that's just the nature of change, so will many Cubans die when Castro is gone and Mcdonalds are instituted in Havana, so people die every day in Colombia or Chiapas not to mention the ones who die in the hands of American soldiers in Iraq...so...what if he killed people? how does that make him any less? That should not take away for whatever good he did...or blur his intentions... Consequences, circumstances...irrelevant...everybody has a job and that was his.
Let's say no to America then...bunch of thieves in suits that come on camera with pretty words that come down to "we want that oil and we will kill for it." all for the greatness of this great nation. BS!
Let's have you in Che's shoes and then see how you react...then, just then...we will talk.
# posted by 
: 20/1/05 19:27
Yes during war, a revolution or anything like that innocent people die, is unavoidable. The question is whether innocent people are deliberately targeted which seems to be what you imply about U.S. soldiers. If you really think so, you might as well call our soldiers terrorists and get it out of your sistem. Going back to Che, you apparently mean that after the new Cuban government was established and all of Batista's people either fled or were executed they were still at war. How else would you justify Che's killing? And if so, how was the Cuban people their enemy? I cannot see how after a government is established and the fighting has ended anyone can defend that just because a citizen verbally disagrees with its government, that citizen should be shot. If you justify that, according to your argument, it would be justified for the government to come to your house, take you away and execute you for saying what you just wrote here with the excuse of the war on terror. Yes, it is the same thing. Please explain to me how you agree with that because it is mind boggling. And while you are at it explain to me how being a Jehova Witness deserved to not only be called a social "deviant" but also to be KILLED for their religious believes as well. And that wasn't part of a war or a revolution, that was the new sistem of government he and Castro put in place in Cuba. Which today for doing the same thing if you are not executed you will be put in jail for 20 YEARS!!!. And the guy wanted to bring that same sistem to ALL Latin America....and you still say that the good intentions he had should not be blurred for what he INTENTIONALLY AND DELIBERATELY DID. What good are any intentions if you beleive that anyone who disagrees with those intentions should get a bullet in the head? This is unbelievable!!!
You need to rethink what you truly believe in and if you are a Che supporter a Communist, who agrees with those deeds and think the United States like you said is "BS" then just say that. This country will allow you to do so freely, even if Che did not allow the Cubans or anyone, to do the same thing.
# posted by Gabemaster : 21/1/05 01:08
>> hehehe...the truth...like...we were all lied to or something...facts are facts, the man is a killer...isn't he?...he's always been...too bad you found out too late. Question...how many che guevara tshirts did you have before you finally saw the light?
Yes during war, a revolution or anything like that innocent people die, is unavoidable. The question is whether innocent people are deliberately targeted which seems to be what you imply about U.S. soldiers. If you really think so, you might as well call our soldiers terrorists and get it out of your sistem.
>>No, soldiers are not...but the ones running the biz are. The ones saying that there were nuclear weapons in Iraq, the ones sending troops whenever they can make a profit...they are. The only difference is that the United Nations ok's it...right? that makes it for a good democracy right??...where taxes are higher everyday...talk about comunism...do it, see the basis of that system and compare it to our so called democracy. I bet that the price for our freedom of speech is way too high.
Going back to Che, you apparently mean that after the new Cuban government was established and all of Batista's people either fled or were executed they were still at war. How else would you justify Che's killing? And if so, how was the Cuban people their enemy? I cannot see how after a government is established and the fighting has ended anyone can defend that just because a citizen verbally disagrees with its government, that citizen should be shot. If you justify that, according to your argument, it would be justified for the government to come to your house, take you away and execute you for saying what you just wrote here with the excuse of the war on terror. Yes, it is the same thing. Please explain to me how you agree with that because it is mind boggling.
>>No explanation required...it happens everywhere, deal with it, and get it over with. Trace all dictatorships and regimes that came from wars and revolutions...same trends same killings. It bothers you since it happened 90 miles from Florida...right?...it can happen all over again anywhere.
And while you are at it explain to me how being a Jehova Witness deserved to not only be called a social "deviant" but also to be KILLED for their religious believes as well. And that wasn't part of a war or a revolution, that was the new sistem of government he and Castro put in place in Cuba. Which today for doing the same thing if you are not executed you will be put in jail for 20 YEARS!!!. And the guy wanted to bring that same sistem to ALL Latin America....
>>I'm gonna pass on that...cause that was really fucked up. Bad che bad che.
and you still say that the good intentions he had should not be blurred for what he INTENTIONALLY AND DELIBERATELY DID. What good are any intentions if you beleive that anyone who disagrees with those intentions should get a bullet in the head? This is unbelievable!!!
>>whoever gets in the way of the cause gets a bullet in the head. Period.
You need to rethink what you truly believe in and if you are a Che supporter a Communist, who agrees with those deeds and think the United States like you said is "BS" then just say that. This country will allow you to do so freely, even if Che did not allow the Cubans or anyone, to do the same thing.
>>I am not supporting anyone, but I am not saying everybody against Che just because after being a fan i discover he's not something I should promote. It bothers me when I see that people don't know what the fuck is going on and start wearing shirts and being fans and all of the sudden they have a change of hearts. Wether you want it or not, Che is an icon, and even if he killed or stood up for something that in theory was good but in practice was fucked up, the man stood up for his beliefs and made things happen one way or another. That my friend, deserves respect.
# posted by : 21/1/05 19:29
“hehehe...the truth...like...we were all lied to or something...facts are facts, the man is a killer...isn't he?...he's always been...too bad you found out too late. Question...how many che guevara tshirts did you have before you finally saw the light?
For the most part, people are not directly lied to, but they are deceived. By just spreading the one side of his story most people ignore what he really was.
Answer… one, bought it back in ‘97 on my first trip back to D.R. It was actually cool, it not only had his face but the word Che in big letters vertically. Until it faded and got rid of it.
“No, soldiers are not...but the ones running the biz are. The ones saying that there were nuclear weapons in Iraq, the ones sending troops whenever they can make a profit...they are. “
Scroll down to the post called Año Viejo where you’ll see who is the biggest beneficiary of this war, something that will come as a shock to you…The Iraqi people. And on the post called Leftist Mentality you’ll see who else said that there were weapons in Iraq. I guess they lied too in order to make a profit and become terrorists.
“The only difference is that the United Nations ok's it...right? that makes it for a good democracy right??”
Whether you like it or not that’s the way it is. It’s part of its charter and every member state of the U.N. has to abby by it. And if you are one of those who thinks the U.N. did not approve this war, again read Leftist Mentality.
“...where taxes are higher everyday...”
Taxes higher everyday? Are you sure you are living in the U.S.? EVERYBODY got a tax brake. Yes you hear all the time that it was only for the rich. Wrong, the tax brake went across the board to everybody.
"talk about communism...do it, see the basis of that system and compare it to our so called democracy.”
Ok, lets talk about communism, yes the basis, the written form of it, is pretty much a perfect world. Is a beautiful thing and our society today cannot compare itself to it. So what is the problem? That as a system of government, is not REALISTIC!! All human beings are greedy and that’s the end of it, it will never work as a system of government.!! If you don’t agree, then I challenge you to name one Communist government that has not degenerated into a totalitarian, oppressive regime.
“I bet that the price for our freedom of speech is way too high.”
How in the world is it? If you say because of our current taxes I will just laugh.
“No explanation required...it happens everywhere, deal with it, and get it over with. Trace all dictatorships and regimes that came from wars and revolutions...same trends same killings. It bothers you since it happened 90 miles from Florida...right?...it can happen all over again anywhere.”
Where do I say or even hint that it doesn't’t happen everywhere? And the question I asked is how can you justify Che for killing people just for disagreeing with the government he helped put in place. With your answer you are telling me that dictatorships are justified because they simply happen and should just be accepted. I disagree.
[About the Jehovah Witnesse’s]
“I'm gonna pass on that...cause that was really fucked up. Bad che bad che.”
So, despite admitting that this was fucked up, you STILL have respect for the guy. Again, Mind Boggling.
“whoever gets in the way of the cause gets a bullet in the head. Period.”
Again, so according to you just because it is that way you feel is acceptable. So by you disagreeing with the war, the United States government should put a bullet in your head? And it is the same thing because those people he killed were apparently in the "way" just because they disagreed with the government. Is just ridiculous to respect that.
“I am not supporting anyone, but I am not saying everybody against Che just because after being a fan i discover he's not something I should promote. It bothers me when I see that people don't know what the fuck is going on and start wearing shirts and being fans and all of the sudden they have a change of hearts.”
So I guess you have never been mislead, or deceived and then realized the truth, or found out that something wasn’t what you thought it was and then tried to tell others what you discovered. Wow! You must be perfect. Or even worse, is that I guess when you have found out when something did not turn out to be what you thought it was, you simply dismissed the truth and stuck to your erroneous beliefs. That would be pitiful.
“Whether you want it or not, Che is an icon…”
If you read carefully I acknowledge that whether I like it or not he is a legend.
“ …and even if he killed or stood up for something that in theory was good but in practice was fucked up, the man stood up for his beliefs and made things happen one way or another. That my friend, deserves respect.”
Ok, so go right ahead and say you have respect for Adolph Hitler as well. Based on everything you said they both earned it from you. In my case, I don’t think so. I have no respect for people who deny others their life or freedom just for having differences of opinions.
There is NOTHING that could ever justify it and I cannot see how if anyone agrees with that concept, can also try justify or even have “respect” for people like Che.
This,is just sad.
# posted by Gabemaster : 22/1/05 10:33
# posted by : 22/1/05 11:23
# posted by Lizzie González : 25/2/05 15:27
# posted by : 25/2/05 15:35
F.C.
# posted by : 25/2/05 16:17
era fan del che por que en el momento al igual que tu, era victima de la ignorancia colectiva. Yo no tengo la mente tan cerrada como de seguir con mis creencias erroneas despues de saber la verdad. En especial cuando creia ese mito del Che basado en lo que decia la gente y la creencia popular. La misma que seguro sigues tu. No tienes que tomar mi palabra, si tomas el tiempo de investigar la funcion del Che en el gobierno Cubano despues de la revolucion Cubana (como cuando era el jefe de "La Cabaña")te daras cuenta de lo que hizo. Pero basandome en lo que as escrito apuesto a que aun teniendo la verdad frente a ti decidiras echarla a un lado y seguir crellendo en ese mito por que la verdad se te ara dificil y no la querras aceptar.
F.C.
Habla con cualquier Cubano que estubo vivo cuando el Che era parte del gobierno y te dira lo mismo. Cualquier libro o enciclopedia objetivo sobre la vida del che o de la revolucion cubana te menciona como minimo que el estuvo encargado de "La Cabaña" donde el regimen ejecutaba gente por doquier en el paredon. Fue el mismo Che quien escribio lo de mandar gente al paredon sin pruebas judiciales. Todo eso esta documentado en muchas fuentes por que su forma de pensar nunca fue secreta el le dijo al mundo lo que el pensaba. Lo que a sucedido es que como los simpatizantes del izquierdismo lo tomaron como simbolo convenientemente no mencionaban esos actos por el. Creando una leyenda que ya a trascendido una generacion. Pero los hechos de el hablan por si mismo.
# posted by Gabemaster : 1/3/05 01:27
# posted by : 1/3/05 06:47
# posted by : 1/3/05 08:09
# posted by : 1/3/05 16:32
- Gabemaster
Then you must definitely hate our current U.S. President, right?
# posted by : 5/3/05 12:41
# posted by : 5/3/05 12:51
And is very simple if you feel the U.S. is so horrible to others then get the hell out. Otehrwise you are supposrting the very same country you feel is soo bad therefore making you a hypocrite
# posted by Gabemaster : 5/3/05 14:59
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